The setter is in the setting position; the pointer is pointing.
Yes. There used to be a distinction between these behaviors.
Now, setters point upright.
Apparently, the behaviors are inherited the same way. Hugh Dalziel wrote about setter-pointer crosses known as “droppers.” The first cross were generally good dogs in the first cross, but breeding crosses to each other tended to produce dogs that were no good at pointing or setting.
I think we see this in humans as well, there are many crosses within the human species and they have produced people who set and point at the faults of others. ;-)
Seriously, this is the beauty of open registries. Genetics is the science of experimentation. The foundation breeders knew this, breeders with landraces know this and the others never get it.
If the cross did not produce the desired pointer, setter, flusher or retriever they went back and tried again. What did not work out was culled or given away, but they were always introducing new blood when they had to make a correction.
The extremely upright stance and “12 o’clock tail” are developments brought about by field trial fashion. You’ll have to look a long way to find an upright tail on any pointing dogs pictured before field trials came into vogue. Early pointer men would have been horrified to see their dogs with a “hound’s stern” (tail).
Sometimes I imagine what would happen if we could bring some breed founders forward in time and have people parade their ‘much improved’ examples of their breeds before them. The resulting scenes would make for great reality TV, I’d bet.
Setters and setting spaniels were used well before development of firearms for feathered game. Dogs that “set” or lay crouched while indicating game allowed nets to be drawn over them and the birds. There are some interesting old illustrations of hunting in such a way in medieval times.
Several dog historians have written that the setter is “an improved spaniel”. And they do still have much in common.
Here’s something from redsetter.blogspot.com
The Biscuit Eater, 1940 version
As for common characteristics there has been an interest in pointing labs for some time, most of the lab people I know laugh at this “sales gimmick” because they say any lab can point. For that matter my golden can point too. When he sets it’s a matter of affected dialect.
Thank you for embedding this.
I LOVE this movie!
Looks like the link is missing
Border collies can point, too.
I think some of their eye-stalk behavior and ticking actually come from English setters, the old kind that used to crouch.